nitrate problems

[dale]

is there anyone in sarnia that could come over and tell me what im doing wrong or what i could do better with my fowler system, its 100gal with a 20 gal sump turning about 400gal per hour and an aquaclear 110 with a sponge and bio balls. i have 2 lionfish, 1 puffer and a snowflake eel. in the past 5 days ive put in a reactor with carbon, nitrate remover and phosphate remover,  did a 20 gal water change 3 times, dosed with prime yesterday and fed very little and the nitrates are getting worse and the fish are getting sicker, i put the puffer in a hospital tank with meds and he got better, now the lionfish are in there too. the tank has been running since december and the fish have been in there for about a month, the puffer was constantly sifting through the gravel the whole time (i dont know if that would impact anything). any help would be appreciated, thanx.,.,,., Dale

 

[Blob-79]

what are your nitrate levels at?

 

[Duke]

a skimmer would probably help keep everything in check, but wont help get rid of the nitrates that are already there. The bio balls could be the cause so maybe try removing them for a bit and see if that helps, same thing with the sponge in the aquaclear. you can also carbon dose and get great results ( best bet is to use vinnegar over vodka imo) Are you using rodi water? was the gravel new? do you still have the macro algae from me in your sump, and is it growing for you?)

 

[IrishPride]

Sounds like you are doing the right things.
What is your nitrate level at? What are you using to test?

Excess food, dead livestock, fish crap, excessive movement of sand and live rocks were all things I had to learn contributed to similar problems I had experienced when starting out with my own FOWLR system.  I was always paranoid of my nitrate levels with a FOWLR, but 40 or less is pretty much normal with a medium bio-load.  Mine got up to 80 at one point and I damn near had a heart attack.  I've read that 100 isn't life threatening but obviously the higher the levels the increased risk of disease.

My biggest contributing factor for my problems was always moving things in my tank regularly.  In doing this I moved a lot of sand and exposed surfaces of live rock that normally weren't exposed.  This create all kinds of issues.  My nitrates spiked significantly because I uncovered food, and I also had a few dead snails and a shrimp I didn't know about.  Moving the sand as much as I did created an ammonia spike that I didn't immediately catch which obviously nearly wiped out my tank. 

You should test for ammonia and nitrite also.

Post your test results.  Lots of great people/knowledge on this site.

 

[teebone110]

Have you tested ammonia levels? I would assume ur tank has successfully cycled. As mentioned get an accurate level for your nitrates and see if any changes make a differencce. The bioballs and sponge filter can trap detritus and add to your nitrates.

Chaeto, protein skimmer, and activated carbon can all help prevent high nitrate levels. The key is to remove excess nutrients before they have a chance to develop into nitrates.

Also what is your water source like? TDS? Are you using RODI?

Water xhanges and nutrient export methods would be your best move to reduce nitrates.
A good over-rated skimmer is highly recommended.

 

[phi delt reefer]

if you got the money (~$25)- a quick and easy solution is Prodbio BioDigest that Incredible Aquarium sells. This will help further seed your de-nitrification bacteria population.

You have a lot of MESSY fish so a good skimmer and larger water changes are in order to keep things balanced. Snails will help break down dietrus and un eaten food to hurry along the breakdown process.

 

[Petercar (RIP Dec 2017)]

Imfrom sarnia and I wouldn't know what to tell yu.  ..I have a hob seaclone skimmer of yu wanna use it.    If it till works

 

[Petercar (RIP Dec 2017)]

That seaclone won't do worth shit    With yur big setup ..but it could buy yu some time till yu get a good skimmer ..unless yu can go get one from bill

 

[dale]

oop: the lionfishes didnt survive the transition to the hospital,(puffer is normal now) my nitrates were between 40 and 80 with an api test kit. amonia and nitrite were fine, the eyes went cloudy on all 3 fish and the puffer was covered in white spots that looked like ich, but the fish were in hypo for 2 mos with no fish in the tank, i have a skimmer that seems to be working fine, and the macro seems to be growing. i guess i will remove the aquaclear all together and put just carbon in the reactor,., i am sooo upset i just wanna smash the f*&^%$ thing! if anyone from sarnia heard a piercing scream this aft,,. it was just me. will keep you posted.

 

[dale]

i use ro water and i was thinking of doseing with vodka, but i installed the sump instead, i guess i may need to dose with vodka too. i thought fish only tanks were supposed to be easier than reef tanks.,.,., not for me dammit!

 

[dale]

amonia and nitrite are at 0 and the nitrates finally come down to about 20. figures after the fish are gone, (story of my life), the eel still looks ok and im gunna leave the puffer in the hospital, remove the aquaclear, and see if i can lower the nitrates even more to make shure i can control it before i add more fish, thanks everyone! more heads are better than 1.

 

[AdInfinitum]

Dale,

IMO you need to look somewhere other than at nitrates for the source of your issues/contamination.  Unless you are keeping very sensitive (usually deep water) species of fish, which you aren't/weren't (sorry) nitrates are not toxic to most fish (other than new born fry/eggs) until they reach several hundred mg/l.  Hard research on species fished and farmed commercially (my mother's field before she retired, BTW) put toxic levels for many adult marine species at 4000+ mg/l.  Yes 4000+ (not a typo!)

My 200gal that has become the home of the fish from my old old old 125 (U/G filter, canister (nitrate factory!), macro's in display) has nitrates in the 150 mg/l range currently, which is lower than it ever was in the 125. Large Sohal, Niger, tomato clown, cleaner wrasse, huge LTA, some shrooms and polyps...healthy for years.

I'm not trying to say that nitrates are OK ( a battle I've been fighting for decades...modern skimmers are a god-send), or be to negative to you...Just saying that you probably need to look elsewhere for the source of your grief. 

Once , years ago, after killing all the contents of 2 tanks, and halting water changes in my others until I knew what was going on...I eventually realized that a salt bucket that didn't quite seal air-tight, stored in a room where cleaning chemical were used, had absorbed toxins through the air...

I may not be able to show anyone the path to success...but hopefully someone can learn from my many mistakes.

Rob
 

 

[dale]

ok, i beleive what you r saying, what else could cause this.,really cloudy eyes, started getting lethargic, sitting still for long periods of time and near the end started loosing color, they ate mostly shrimp and some fish from superstore fish deli,the puffer and eel eat the same thing the puffer was sick also but got better after a clean hospital and some kordon rid ich plus (formaldihide) i was just thinking the the nitrates were allowing all this to happen , not nessesarily toxifing them but breaking down their defences. but i dont really know ive allways had a pretty good idea why a fish dies ie: mistakes, disease. and i dont really know what is going on now.

 

[Blob-79]

I agree. I doubt the nitrates were the cause, or even the trigger.

I dont have any other suggestions, other then by chance has neopimp come by for a visit recently?

 

[Petercar (RIP Dec 2017)]

The eel and the puffer  where at the lowest part of the tank.  And are the survivors?....looks like a free floating disease

 

[AdInfinitum]

I have always been a feeder of things from the grocery store but very carefully since phosphates and copper are used as anti-bacterial's and preservatives in human food....

However, never put anything from the fresh/live area of the deli straight into you tank!! they can be full of all sorts of parasites and pathogens that can and eventually will kill your livestock.  Fresh seafood is only inspected and tested for things that pose a threat to humans!!! Furthermore infectious materials from cold or temperate water "foods" may be killed by the high temps of a reef but your tropical creatures probably have had no exposure and therefore have no resistance to cold water strains of diseases.

I still feed "things from the seafood counter" but they all get bought fresh and are all frozen for at least a few days to kill any parasites or pathogens before being thawed and fed to my tanks.  This is actually better than buying frozen, in that phosphates are often added during the processing of commercial frozen foods and even naturally occurring phosphates in meats will leach out into the thaw-water when you do the freeze/thaw routine.