StartSmart Complete

[yveterinarian]

The purpose of this review is to test StartSmart Complete without any other bacteria influences present (the best I can do, anyways without a laboratory).  StartSmart Complete is a live bacteria product that does not need refrigeration and states it will "instantly cycle aquariums".  There are two versions of this product - one for Saltwater and one for Freshwater.  I used the one for Saltwater.  My review is not meant to create controversy (I know there is a lot about this product), but to test the performance of this product.

Setup of tanks: 
Both tanks were washed with vinegar and rinsed well with water, then small amount of bleach rinsed through, rinsed thoroughly then rinsed well with de-chlorinator and rinsed again.  Sand used was Caribsea Aragonite and was rinsed well, brought to a boil and boiled for 1 hour to kill any latent bacteria and allowed to cool before adding to tanks.  Rock used was dry Eco rock.

Both tanks were set up using the same saltwater.  One tank will be tested using fish in system looking for a 24 hour cycle and the second tank will be used to cycle without fish.  For the purposes of this experiment Tank 1 will have fish, Tank 2 will not.  Both tanks have a small biowheel pump for water circulation an airline and a heater to keep the temp at 78*F.  Water parameters for each tested using API test kits that have expiry date of 2014.  I also am aware that API is not the best test kit but at present, it is the best I have for these particular parameters. 

Day 0 - Setup day

Tank 1                                                              Tank 2
Ammonia - 0                                                      Ammonia - 0
Nitrite - 0                                                            Nitrite - 0
Nitrate - 0                                                          Nitrate - 0
Ph - 8.2                                                              Ph - 8.2
Salinity 1.023                                                      Salinity 1.023

5 lbs sand and 5 lbs rock added                          5 lbs sand and 5 lbs rock added
Total - 10 lbs                                                      Total - 10 lbs

Water allowed to settle and 1 oz                        Water allowed to settle and 1 oz
StartSmart for salt water added                          StartSmart for saltwater added
at 1830                                                                at 1830

2 Damsels added at 1900                                    25 drops ammonia added to simulate fish
                                                                            waste added at 1900 (this brought the
                                                                            ammonia level to 1ppm)

The following values were taken in the early evening each day to try to maintain consistency in the reading of the values (time of day, light present that values were read by) 

Day 1

Tank 1                                                                Tank 2
Ammonia - 0.25                                                    Ammonia - 1
Nitrite - 0                                                              Nitrite - 0
Nitrate - 0                                                              Nitrate - 0

Day 2

Ammonia - 0.25                                                  Ammonia - 1
Nitrite - 0                                                              Nitrite - 0
Nitrate - 0                                                              Nitrate - 0

Day 3

Ammonia - 1                                                        Ammonia - 1
Nitrite - 0.25                                                          Nitrite - 0.25
Nitrate - 10                                                            Nitrate - 10

Day 4

Ammonia - 1                                                        Ammonia - 1
Nitrite - 0.25                                                          Nitrite - 0.25
Nitrate - 15                                                            Nitrate - 15

I took the Damsels out of Tank 1 as ammonia levels kept going up and I did not wish to damage their gills. (in short, I chickened out but kept the tank going to see what would happen)

Day 5

Tank 1                                                                Tank 2

Ammonia - 0.5                                                      Ammonia - 1
Nitrite - 0.25                                                          Nitrite - 0.5
Nitrate - 5                                                                Nitrate - 20

Day 6

Ammonia - 0.5                                                      Ammonia - 0.25
Nitrite - 1                                                                Nitrite - 1
Nitrate - 5                                                                Nitrate - 20

Day 7

Ammonia - 0.25                                                    Ammonia - 0
Nitrite - 1                                                                Nitrite - 1
Nitrate - 20                                                            Nitrate - 80

Day 8

Ammonia - 0.25                                                      Ammonia - 0
Nitrite - 1                                                                Nitrite - 1
Nitrate - 20                                                              Nitrate - 40

Day 9

Ammonia - 0                                                          Ammonia - 0
Nitrite - 1                                                                Nitrite - 1
Nitrate - 40                                                            Nitrate - 20

Added 25 drops of ammonia to Tank 2 to bring the ammonia level back up to 1ppm.  The next evening my measurements were:

Day 10

Tank 1                                                                Tank 2

Ammonia - 0                                                          Ammonia - 0
Nitrite - 0                                                              Nitrite - 1
Nitrate - 80                                                            Nitrate - 40


For each of the next four days I added 25 drops of Ammonia to Tank 2 and it was cycled out of the tank within 24 hours.  By Day 14, it was cycled out within 8 hours, indicating it was more than ready for fish. 

The values I got for these two tanks were very interesting.  They certainly cycled faster than any tank I have ever cycled before, including my use of Stability (another live bacteria product)  in my ammonia cycled tanks.  Nitrates showed up on Day 3.  I never did get a large Nitrite spike (which I think is because of the presence of Nitrates so early)  but it did eventually come down to zero.  I did not do a large water change on either tanks when the nitrates showed up because I wanted to see what the bacteria would do if they were left to multiply on their own and set up a good population.

My previous tanks have all been cycled using dry rock and non-live Caribsea aragonite.  This is because I had/have a fear of adding anything that could potentially harm my seahorses or my reef when I started that one.  I used a live bacteria product called Stability and each time the cycle lasted 6 weeks before it was completely ready.  (This included testing with repeated doses of Ammonia until 2ppm could be cleared within 8 hours)

I will let you all draw your own conclusions but I must say, nitrates showed up much faster than I have known in cycling my other tanks and I feel there is something about this product that does help speed up the cycle.  I did not get a "instant" or 24 hour cycle but that may have been because I sterilized everything and most other people using this product would not.  Maybe it works in conjunction with bacteria already present in the live rock and sand to help the cycle go faster. 

Thanks for taking the time to read this product review,
Yvette

 

[Salty Cracker]

Re: SmartStart Complete

Interesting.  I must admit I've never heard of anyone worried about hurting a damsel's gills before...I almost think those things could live in pure ammonia. 

 

[yveterinarian]

Interesting.  I must admit I've never heard of anyone worried about hurting a damsel's gills before...I almost think those things could live in pure ammonia. 

I'm always worried about the effects of ammonia on fish - gills, eyes, etc  Just me being a worrywart 

 

[pulpfiction1]

thanks for your time and interest yveterinarian,i myself have been using the product to cycle,cure live rock and help restore unmaintained and abused systems,i have always had amazing results with it

 

[Duke]

Re: SmartStart Complete

While you might call this a "Review", i think that's a bit misleading.. Surely its not living up to its name of "instant cycling". Why exactly would you dose both tanks with it? Your tests are so far beyond flawed before you even started.. comparing 2 damsels and 25 drops of ammonia surely isn't accurate.. who's to say if you had a third tank without the start smart you wouldn't get the same results? or even better results? [size=1em]all your proving is that adding ammonia at 25 drops will introduce ammonia at a higher rate than 2 damsels did.. secondly i really doubt you can even say that with any accuracy because your testing equipment is no where near accurate enough to be posting the numbers you have. All you really indicated is you Conditioned tank 2 with more ammonia.. and from that alone you did get tank 2 to eventually cycle it out faster.. i think that would have been logical outcome regardless of using that product or not.[/size]

 

[davesolo29]

i used it to set up a qt tank quick... seemed to work well.

 

[davesolo29]

Re: SmartStart Complete

While you might call this a \"Review\", i think that's a bit misleading.. Surely its not living up to its name of \"instant cycling\". Why exactly would you dose both tanks with it? Your tests are so far beyond flawed before you even started.. comparing 2 damsels and 25 drops of ammonia surely isn't accurate.. who's to say if you had a third tank without the start smart you wouldn't get the same results? or even better results? [size=1em]all your proving is that adding ammonia at 25 drops will introduce ammonia at a higher rate than 2 damsels did.. secondly i really doubt you can even say that with any accuracy because your testing equipment is no where near accurate enough to be posting the numbers you have. All you really indicated is you Conditioned tank 2 with more ammonia.. and from that alone you did get tank 2 to eventually cycle it out faster.. i think that would have been logical outcome regardless of using that product or not.[/size]

settle down... its already been stated that results are not completely accurate

personnally i wouldnt have added anything but dr. tims to tank 2.

 

[Neopimp]

.....

 

[yveterinarian]

While you might call this a \"Review\", i think that's a bit misleading.. Surely its not living up to its name of \"instant cycling\". Why exactly would you dose both tanks with it? Your tests are so far beyond flawed before you even started.. comparing 2 damsels and 25 drops of ammonia surely isn't accurate.. who's to say if you had a third tank without the start smart you wouldn't get the same results? or even better results? [size=1em]all your proving is that adding ammonia at 25 drops will introduce ammonia at a higher rate than 2 damsels did.. secondly i really doubt you can even say that with any accuracy because your testing equipment is no where near accurate enough to be posting the numbers you have. All you really indicated is you Conditioned tank 2 with more ammonia.. and from that alone you did get tank 2 to eventually cycle it out faster.. i think that would have been logical outcome regardless of using that product or not.[/size]

Duke: 
Have you ever used an ammonia cycle to cycle your tank?  It does not make it cycle faster, as I said in my review regarding the other product I have always used.  Usually, the ammonia cycle takes 4-6 weeks, just as with fish or with live rock.  I was only showing the StartSmart cycled faster than my normal product did.  I did the one with the fish because many people do, but I did the ammonia one for my own knowledge to compare with what I was already familiar with.

I know this is a controversial product and only tested for my knowledge and shared what I found.  What you choose to do with that is up to you and, frankly, I don't care what you do with it.  I know of an extremely reputable seahorse breeder who always uses TurboStart (a product similar to StartSmart) to cycle his tanks and tells me they are fully cycled in 5 days.  Many people on this Forum would say "NO WAY CAN THIS BE DONE" but he has for years and I trust him.
If something can help in the cycle process when you are in a rush due to unforseen circumstances, wouldn't you want to know if there is something that can help? (maybe not, but I do)
I know it didn't cycle instantly or in 24 hours but it did cycle faster, as I said in my article.  A product "Review" isn't intended to "prove" anything.  It is intended to show what results a person has with a product and compare (if possible) with another product you have used.  I checked the Review Sticky before I posted to see what the goals should be in a review. 

 

[yveterinarian]

thanks for your time and interest yveterinarian,i myself have been using the product to cycle,cure live rock and help restore unmaintained and abused systems,i have always had amazing results with it

Thanks Phil:

Sorry I wimped out on the fish but I left them in there long enough to get the ammoina level to 1ppm so that it matched the other tank.  Sorry also that I don't have better test kits, I'm working on it and am replacing them with Red sea when I can get the money together.  For now though, I know for myself that it worked faster than my normal method and, when I get my fry tanks going and have to break down, sterilize and setup quickly for the next brood I'll know what I can use if another batch is on the way quickly. 

PS - the one that had the fish in it cycled faster, not the ammonia one, when you look at the results 

 

[teebone110]

Interesting review....

To conduct another experiment, I would set the control tank as follows...

Tank 1 - day 1- start with 2 damsels and no product

... and the experimental tank as follows...

Tank 2 - day 1 - start with 2 damsels and "magic potion"

- set up both tanks the exact same way
- feed both tanks the exact same amounts each day
- measure and record the parameters the same way

This would provide a more rigorous methodology which would limit any potential bias errors to identify if the "magic potion" makes a significant difference with the time it takes to cycle a tank.

Applause to yveterinarian for taking an interest and the time to look into this.
Call me old-fashioned, but I think the damsels would be fine for the purpose of cycling a tank. If you prefer to be more PITA-like, substitute the damsels for a raw piece of shrimp. But then again, the shrimp were sacrificed for science!  :?

 

[sunnykita]

thanks so very much for posting your experiment and the results. I found it educational.
sunnykita

 

[yveterinarian]

Interesting review....

To conduct another experiment, I would set the control tank as follows...

Tank 1 - day 1- start with 2 damsels and no product

... and the experimental tank as follows...

Tank 2 - day 1 - start with 2 damsels and \"magic potion\"

- set up both tanks the exact same way
- feed both tanks the exact same amounts each day
- measure and record the parameters the same way

This would provide a more rigorous methodology which would limit any potential bias errors to identify if the \"magic potion\" makes a significant difference with the time it takes to cycle a tank.

Applause to yveterinarian for taking an interest and the time to look into this.
Call me old-fashioned, but I think the damsels would be fine for the purpose of cycling a tank. If you prefer to be more PITA-like, substitute the damsels for a raw piece of shrimp. But then again, the shrimp were sacrificed for science!  :?

Thanks, Teebone

Yes, it would be an interesting way to do the experiment.  Would you use live rock instead of dry?  It might cycle even faster with all that extra bacteria present.  I just didn't want anyone to say that another bacteria was responsible other than the ones in StartSmart complete.

The reason I chose one with the ammonia method is to do a comparison with what I already knew.  I have only ever used the ammonia method so wouldn't have been able to compare this product with one known to me if I had set up the way you suggest.  Also, the API test kits were what I had used in all of my other setups so I wouldn't have been able to do a proper comparison either with another test kit.

I still think the product has merit and, maybe someday when I feel I need more fish, I will do it again using the setup you suggest.  I didn't want to purchase more than I had space for in my existing set up. 

 

[yveterinarian]

thanks so very much for posting your experiment and the results. I found it educational.
sunnykita

Thanks Sunnykita: 
I have always thirsted for knowledge and feel others may be the same.  The "tried and true" isn't always the only thing out there. 

 

[teebone110]

[quote author=teebone110 link=topic=4066.msg36477#msg36477 date=1358399162]
Interesting review....

To conduct another experiment, I would set the control tank as follows...

Tank 1 - day 1- start with 2 damsels and no product

... and the experimental tank as follows...

Tank 2 - day 1 - start with 2 damsels and \"magic potion\"

- set up both tanks the exact same way
- feed both tanks the exact same amounts each day
- measure and record the parameters the same way

This would provide a more rigorous methodology which would limit any potential bias errors to identify if the \"magic potion\" makes a significant difference with the time it takes to cycle a tank.

Applause to yveterinarian for taking an interest and the time to look into this.
Call me old-fashioned, but I think the damsels would be fine for the purpose of cycling a tank. If you prefer to be more PITA-like, substitute the damsels for a raw piece of shrimp. But then again, the shrimp were sacrificed for science!  :?

Thanks, Teebone

Yes, it would be an interesting way to do the experiment.  Would you use live rock instead of dry?  It might cycle even faster with all that extra bacteria present.  I just didn't want anyone to say that another bacteria was responsible other than the ones in StartSmart complete.

The reason I chose one with the ammonia method is to do a comparison with what I already knew.  I have only ever used the ammonia method so wouldn't have been able to compare this product with one known to me if I had set up the way you suggest.  Also, the API test kits were what I had used in all of my other setups so I wouldn't have been able to do a proper comparison either with another test kit.

I still think the product has merit and, maybe someday when I feel I need more fish, I will do it again using the setup you suggest.  I didn't want to purchase more than I had space for in my existing set up. 
[/quote]

The keep things consistent in both tanks with the only change being the experimental "magic potion"

I would use an equal amount of substrate and rock, I dont think it matters if its live or dead as long as it is the same in both tanks.

Also, I wouldnt worry about the test kits, if you are using the same ones to measure both tanks and reading them the same way.

 

[yveterinarian]

The keep things consistent in both tanks with the only change being the experimental \"magic potion\"

I would use an equal amount of substrate and rock, I dont think it matters if its live or dead as long as it is the same in both tanks.

Also, I wouldnt worry about the test kits, if you are using the same ones to measure both tanks and reading them the same way.

Thanks Teebone, I'll keep that in mind for another time.  Thanks, also for taking my review in the spirit it was intended.    That's the way I felt about the test kits and why I also stated I measured at the same approximate time of day with the same lighting, etc so I could read them the same way. 

 

[sunnykita]

that's the wonderful thing about the forum, we can all learn from each other ! I like it, I have a lot to learn !!
sunnykita