Phosphates, nutrients and Test kit Discussion.

[curiousphil]

[quote author=BIGSHOW link=topic=2295.msg78700#msg78700 date=1390998779]
[quote author=spyd link=topic=2295.msg78672#msg78672 date=1390962092]
Those are some crazy high values. Is the OP blasting the corals with some insanely high par?? I know Jay at RR had some high PO4 levels and nitrates in his tanks but he had those MH blasting an inch off the water. In a typical reef setup though, I would think it would be nearly impossible to keep SPS thriving. I noticed browning and issues at .08ppm in my tank and that is when the alarm bells rang for me.

Very true.  I tested Jay's system several times and the results were incredible (I seriously tested 3 times in a row as I couldn't believe it).  N03 100ppm+, P04 wouldn't even register on the regular checker.  I even brought in some of my own water and tested both of at the same time, repeatedly, and got the same results every time (+/- 5%).  He has said recently that his levels are back in check. 

I agree that this isn't the norm and for people to generally think you can run a successful SPS tank with crazy high nutrient levels is not something I would recommend.  Can you have colourful SPS with high nutrients? From what I have seen, it is possible, however, I do think there is something else that needs to "counter" the high levels, like crazy PAR or some other unknown we haven't really thought of.  Is it also possible that some Acros are just more tolerant of nutrient rich systems? Maybe the people with the high nutrient levels lost 50 corals for every 1 coral that survived and adapted to the high nutrient levels?

It is a very interesting debate.  I have been following it for the most part, but that Allmost character really ruins threads with his attitude (how he isn't banned is beyond me, Ben, you did much less to get banned then that crazy character!).  Very happy I don't see him on this forum .
[/quote]

Well I did say some harsh things toward Michael.... He really upset me when he clearly was misrepresenting his product and GHL seemed to back him too which frustrated me even further....I try not to let my emotions run so high any more but man I am about 2/3s through that RC thread and I would definitely be posting for sure if I could lol....obviously not in the way I did towards Michael, but I have soooooo many ?s and doubts and oh man why do I have to be banned!!!!! but did I miss something or what tester is the OP using?? Anyways, gonna finish up reading through the thread....


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[/quote]

Just register with a different email :devil:

 

[Bayinaung]

Dude, where are the pics! I can't live on alphabet soup man.  pics pics pics!

 

[spyd]

I guess I could just cough up the $30 for the year and get things working again... I hate paying for subscriptions though. I am too cheap and takes away from my coral spending money. lol.

 

[unibob]

Delete the album called porn and I bet they show up with tons of room to spare.

 

[jroovers]

Perhaps a mod could open a new thread with a lot of discussion about the RC thread and the nitrate and phosphate levels from this thread transferred over....?


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Worthwhile in my opinion.  I missed the part about the RR numbers initially, that is pretty crazy.

 

[Bayinaung]

I guess I could just cough up the $30 for the year and get things working again... I hate paying for subscriptions though. I am too cheap and takes away from my coral spending money. lol.

I wouldn't pay for subs either. Why don't you upload the pics to either google picasa (2 gig limit, so create a new account just for reef pics) or to tinypic.com where you upload one by one no need for an account and you don't have to pay anything. and there's no limit there. I came here for more reef porn. MUST HAVE MY PICS lolol.

 

[Reef Hero]

Ok so I'm not sure if we are getting a seperate thread or not but I'm going to carry on regardless...
I want to talk more about the RC thread.... I would be very interested to know what thale got as numbers for po4 using the Hanna checker.... He mentioned he got numbers all over the place which has been common for a lot of ppl using the ULR checker lately. I so badly want to know what numbers he got and what reagent lot he is using. When I was getting skewed results I would get numbers close to 1ppm also... Look at the results Boga posted regarding the bad reagent lot 25....!!
Not really too sure at all how he goes about lab testing his po4 or whatever method he is claiming to use but that does not mean it is 100 percent accurate either.... Did anyone catch how he tests nitrate? He originally claimed over 100ppm but then later it seemed to be closer to 20ppm.... What happened here? Was he lab testing his nitrate also?

Ok, I went back and read Thales nitrate numbers again and it looks like he tested like 70ppm at "work" and then 50ppm using AWT....this is still only half of the original claim of 100ppm... I guess what I'm saying is that I'm skeptical of his testing methods

 

[AdInfinitum]

Had a run through the thread and where I find a lot to agree with I find the OP's agenda is to debunk "conventional" wisdom (I'm ok with that) while vigorously and/or evasively avoiding any attempt to establish any alternative hypotheses (not ok IMO).

Back on the subject of nutrients...I think one of the primary concerns that I have with the quest for zeros particularly re: phosphates is that it seems to lose sight of the fact that all biological processes that appear static are merely in equilibrium.  Corals are constantly taking in and expelling phosphate as part of their metabolic processes with overall net intake during the day and net output at night.  By stripping the phosphates completely out of the column we are depending on food and fish waste to locally supply the daily intake needs. 

Perhaps I notice the negative effects of very low PO4 levels due to my very small fish population and sparse feeding since I am trying to combat the nitrates.  Incidentally I have killed far more Frags while playing with high carbon dosing, massive water changes and other experiments aimed at getting the nitrates under control, than when I have just taken a break and let things stabilize high nutrients and all.


And Brandon, isn't that Stag amazing!!  Rick had it and apparently it wouldn't colour up.  DTI got it and it coloured up for him. I got it from him and it just went wild in my tank.

 

[Poseidon]

And Brandon, isn't that Stag amazing!!  Rick had it and apparently it wouldn't colour up.  DTI got it and it coloured up for him. I got it from him and it just went wild in my tank.

it was nice but nothing special til i moved it over, its under CHINA LED, and its the bluest ive seen on any coral lol, just beautiful

i think i might setup a system to put all my sps in to lower their standards, and then transfer them over to my good system and watch them colour up like crazy

 

[Duke]

Dave, Iirc tho, Jay lost a bunch of coral and even had u holding some because of those high nutrient readings I thought?

 

[Thales]

http://www.reefsmagazine.com/forum/reefs-magazine/159813-skeptical-reefkeeping-ix-test-kits-chasing-numbers-phosphate.html

 

[Reef Hero]

Richard, you made it! What a surprise!!



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