Reef raft

[Reef Hero]

[quote author=Reef Hero link=topic=7766.msg82696#msg82696 date=1393021217]

[quote author=Duke link=topic=7766.msg82695#msg82695 date=1393020952]
hardly anything at RR is rare..

Please explain.....


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[/quote]

everything is wild.. multiple colonies are imported all the time.. so they definitively aren't rare...
[/quote]

Again, duke you have to look past the name tag....to the coral itself....RR imports tons of corals....some are rare and some are not.... Another example would be the named Mr. Pacman or Needle in a Haystack Acro.... Is it rare? No, I see it everywhere.... So why would I pay $100 for the mr. Pacman when I can buy a small colony for $50....


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[BIGSHOW]

I think that the hobbyists are going to validate the actual growth, rareness, etc of the corals....I'm not sure if I would actually consider this hype. Hype is what usually comes from the vendors, saturated pics, or ppl wanting the coral or complaining about the price,etc....

This happens everytime RR photos are posted (not the saturation of the pics as I think the pics are pretty good, you can see some of my pics vs. others that have been posted), but there are ppl wanting the corals as a result of the photos and then the price discussion starts...

It's obvious that there were little to zero hobbyists validating the actual JD in the USA and yet the hype there is what caused the JD to sell for $1200.....

There were several threads posted across the major forms a while ago when the JD first appeared on facebook, there was a thread on RC where there was lots of validation going on (I was part of it), and the photos posted by Richard were true to life (at least in my eyes).  Which brings me back to the point of hobbyists/collectors validating the coral

When I talk about or post pics (soon, I promise) of the JD I don't feel like I am hyping up the coral but rather validating its rarity, beauty, and growth....
I could easily speak negative about the JD or any other high end coral for that matter so for RR to go out on a limb and sell to true hobbyists that will truthfully validate the coral for them and others it is definitely a risk that RR is taking also....

I don't really see the risk in selling a coral to a hobbyists who was willing to shell out big money.  No hobbyist is going to spend big money on a coral they just handpicked just to rip the coral (at least I hope not), IMO there is little to no risk here.


Even if the coral is exactly as pictured SOME people are going to hate, just the way it is.  I obviously have a connection with RR and love the high end stuff he has.  I don't buy everything personally as I don't like everything he has, but what I like and what others like is completely subjective.  I would pay big money for a bleeding avengers or Ultimate Orange passion, but I wont pay big money for Blue Peacock, Blue avatar and some others. 

 

[BIGSHOW]

I try not to get to crazy about the latest and greatest, when all I need to do is look at what I already have.

Well said Ty, sometimes we all just need to sit back and take a good look at our beautiful tanks and be happy with what we have and accomplished (You don't need $1000 corals to have a beautiful tank).  I myself don't do this enough, especially since starting the business up.

 

[Reef Hero]

I find the RR Peacock to be stunning....maybe it's different than the Blue Peacock


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[BIGSHOW]

I find the RR Peacock to be stunning....maybe it's different than the Blue Peacock


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I am not sure I have seen the RR Peacock, I probably have, but he has put out so many new ones these days I cant keep up anymore

 

[Darryl_V]

[quote author=Duke link=topic=7766.msg82702#msg82702 date=1393022239]
[quote author=Reef Hero link=topic=7766.msg82696#msg82696 date=1393021217]

[quote author=Duke link=topic=7766.msg82695#msg82695 date=1393020952]
hardly anything at RR is rare..

Please explain.....


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[/quote]

everything is wild.. multiple colonies are imported all the time.. so they definitively aren't rare...
[/quote]

Again, duke you have to look past the name tag....to the coral itself....RR imports tons of corals....some are rare and some are not.... Another example would be the named Mr. Pacman or Needle in a Haystack Acro.... Is it rare? No, I see it everywhere.... So why would I pay $100 for the mr. Pacman when I can buy a small colony for $50....


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[/quote]The pacman or haystack what ever you wanna call it is an example of,it used to be rare. I never have seen it in the hobby till about a year or more ago. It was rare for a while but obviously wild collectors found a lot of it and realized it was in demand at the time. Import a bunch and the magic wears off.

 

[Reef Hero]

One coral that has really amazed me as to how well it has gotten around (well in the USA anyways) is the JOL Lepto.... What amazes me is that this coral has circulated through captive breeding only and not through wild imports like most do. At Lansing coral expo 2013 jfox was selling for $150 and this year it was $60 from jfox himself again....amazing IMO just how well it has circulated and been proven through captivity only...
Once frags here start being released I am interested in seeing its success and with that success will come the price drop on one of the best leptos out there...
I plan on bringing my first frag of it to London FragFest....

The RR JD seems to be a fairly good grower also and I think ppl who paid the $1200 price tag are going to see it reduce very quickly.... But it can't be compared to the JOL still... Just amazing how one small colony brought in by jason fox has populated throughout the USA....

 

[Darryl_V]

Ya it is crazy.  I love those great aqua-culturing corals.  A coral that actually looks great and grows.  Reefraft really doesnt have any of there named corals really take off like this from one single mother.  Maybe the RR reddragon which was rare when it first came out.  I do believe almost all the red dragon in Canada and the US orginated from the one guy here in Canada (RR bought and sold it from him).

Its a good thing the JOL actually grows.  If not the growth I got wouldnt keep up with the deflating price.  Although the price is deflating fast in the US I would imagine we could get slightly more here as its fairly rare in Canada (with only a small handful of people growing it).

 

[jroovers]

I definitely don't think the crayola is rare, but for the price of a nice mari cultured colony like that, money well spent.  I'd take 5 of those coloneis over a frag of many RR pieces I've seen that command high price.  The laws of supply and demand are going to dictate a lot of high prices, as Darryl noted red dragon is a prime example, price has bottomed out as supply has increased exponentially.  Anyhow, as Ty said and Dave echoed, sometimes best just to sit back and enjoy what you've already got, as opposed to shelling out big bucks to chase the next best thing, which might not even be as nice as what you already have (but has a fancy name). 

 

[Reef Hero]

Ya it is crazy.  I love those great aqua-culturing corals.  A coral that actually looks great and grows.  Reefraft really doesnt have any of there named corals really take off like this from one single mother.  Maybe the RR reddragon which was rare when it first came out.  I do believe almost all the red dragon in Canada and the US orginated from the one guy here in Canada (RR bought and sold it from him).

Its a good thing the JOL actually grows.  If not the growth I got wouldnt keep up with the deflating price.  Although the price is deflating fast in the US I would imagine we could get slightly more here as its fairly rare in Canada (with only a small handful of people growing it).

The RR/Tyree Red Dragon still seems to hold a decent price in the USA..... JF told me also that it originated from RR Canada just like pretty much every RR named coral in the states....
Leptos in general are very hardly seen IMO..... Seems like one of the only people bringing them in around North America is JF..... He has got a lot of them as of late.....
The JOL should definitely still be valued a little higher in Canada because it is quite rare here....... I hardly see any leptos at all here to be honest.....

I definitely don't think the crayola is rare, but for the price of a nice mari cultured colony like that, money well spent.  I'd take 5 of those coloneis over a frag of many RR pieces I've seen that command high price.  The laws of supply and demand are going to dictate a lot of high prices, as Darryl noted red dragon is a prime example, price has bottomed out as supply has increased exponentially.  Anyhow, as Ty said and Dave echoed, sometimes best just to sit back and enjoy what you've already got, as opposed to shelling out big bucks to chase the next best thing, which might not even be as nice as what you already have (but has a fancy name).

Everyone is going to go about this hobby in their own way.....
Having the collectors in the hobby who are willing to take the chance on rare unseen corals is what has brought this hobby all the different amazing cultured corals that we have today.....


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[jroovers]

Having the collectors in the hobby who are willing to take the chance on rare unseen corals is what has brought this hobby all the different amazing cultured corals that we have today.....

I agree with you here to an extent, I wouldn't have the corals I have today for the most part if it weren't for Darryl.  I also think that maybe the industry is changing?  Mari-cultured corals are the norm now, but has that always been the case (e.g. versus fully wild pieces)? And people are willing to pay ludicrous prices?  Darryl mentioned that not long ago, $100 was an expensive piece of SPS.  Now we see frags going for $1,000+.  Seems like the industry has caught on to this and is adjusting and capitalizing.  I guess where the hobbyist comes in is deciding what is rare and what has potential... versus being told by the salesman what is rare and unique.

 

[Bayinaung]

Everyone is going to go about this hobby in their own way.....
Having the collectors in the hobby who are willing to take the chance on rare unseen corals is what has brought this hobby all the different amazing cultured corals that we have today.....


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+
I ran into duke in RC about this very discussion there. (and how I got here hehe)

what's surprising is how long some of those name aquacultured corals are taking to get to more shops as they are all being cultured in Bali. I recall a few guys in the US saying they saw similar corals in their LFS whenever wild colonies are brought in. (wc by the way we don't see here recent days). And I can tell you that I'm seeing some of these RR signature pieces in recent shipments (emphasis S) of bali corals in Toronto. So they are making their way out there. slowly but surely.

So they will soon not be exclusive to RR. But what you do get with RR is instant selection of the best looking corals under optimal and *insane* lighting. Definitely a destination for the connoisseur with the means.

 

[Reef Hero]

The thing about companies such as sexy corals marking up corals to a ridiculous price tag into the $1000s is what bugs me the most..... These are not hobbyists or people who care about the hobby at all..... They are simply looking to fill their pockets as much as possible without caring at all about growing out rarer seen frags into colonies..... I can guarantee that SC paid nowhere near $1200 USD for each one of those JD frags they are selling..... Not to mention that the frags landed into their hands only maybe a day or two before being posted directly up for sale so you can see where they stand in this hobby.... The same can be said for pretty much all their corals and the way in which they conduct business....it honestly makes me sick and I have let mike and Annette (sexy corals) know this on many occasions.
Any true collector willing to take the chance on a rare unseen coral frag to grow out himself and then frag for others at a reasonable price like what they paid or less as the market dictates is really what this hobby should be about IMO.


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[Duke]

The thing about companies such as sexy corals marking up corals to a ridiculous price tag into the $1000s is what bugs me the most..... These are not hobbyists or people who care about the hobby at all..... They are simply looking to fill their pockets as much as possible without caring at all about growing out rarer seen frags into colonies..... I can guarantee that SC paid nowhere near $1200 USD for each one of those JD frags they are selling..... Not to mention that the frags landed into their hands only maybe a day or two before being posted directly up for sale so you can see where they stand in this hobby.... The same can be said for pretty much all their corals and the way in which they conduct business....it honestly makes me sick and I have let mike and Annette (sexy corals) know this on many occasions.
Any true collector willing to take the chance on a rare unseen coral frag to grow out himself and then frag for others at a reasonable price like what they paid or less as the market dictates is really what this hobby should be about IMO.


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exactly, i was in no way dissing reef raft, they have nice corals, that demand higher pricing... rare? imo mostly no.. but in some ways i guess they are..  but some vendors like that cornbread dude, for example are selling single polyps of zoas for 400$... scolys for 1000$. 1" chalice frags for even more  . follow reef2reef and you will be disgusted by the amount people are happy to pay that for 1/2" frags, its just crazy.

i just think the tag LE gets thrown around alot.. the JOL is the perfect example.. without knowing the details, theres was only 1 mother colony, at first JF only released a small amount of frags.. all the frags around all originated from the single piece. therefore limited editition makes sense..  Reef Raft stuff.. not so much... i could dig up right now easily 10 different wild colony photos of the coral they call RR Pink Floyd ( or sabretooth, or banana tabler or Bumblebee or wolverine or grapes of wrath) Heck canada corals posted photos of the same exact coral they just brought in themselves.. so how can anyone market it an LE when in fact its very not limited at all.. while it is a super nice coral.. its not rare.. or special (anymore than than it is the eye of the beholder) and while it can demand a premium i guess.. it sure as heck shouldn't be demanding any high prices, because Canada corals was probably selling 15$ frags of it last night... lol

 

[davesolo29]

No.  They weren't.  I tried.  Lol


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